[ List Earliest Comments Only For Pages | Games | Rated Pages | Rated Games | Subjects of Discussion ]
Comments/Ratings for a Single Item
Pincer Pawn. Moves as rook, and takes by enclosing.[All Comments] [Add Comment or Rating]
Anonymous wrote on Tue, Nov 12, 2002 12:38 PM UTC:Sorry, I can't resist ...
<p>
... but the pincer pawn is one of the oldest documented 'chess'
pieces around. The method of movement and capture (know in
german as <em>Wächterschlag</em> dates back to
antique times and was used by the pieces in Petteia (strategic
game in ancient greece) and Ludus latrunculorum. It is also used
in Tablut (game of the Sami people documented by Linné) and
Hnefatafl (game of the Vikings).
<p>
--Jörg Knappen
Jörg Knappen is right; I did not invent the Pincer Pawn, and I never said I did. So Ben Good made a mistake here. The idea behind Ultima was to combine captures from various games into a single game. So most of the other pieces came from other games. But there were some I had to invent myself: The Immobilizer, the Chameleon, and the Coordinator.
i made the original piececlopedia pages for the ultima pieces many years
ago. at the time i was really just trying to take the pieces out of the
context of ultima - with which they are so closely associated - because i
hoped that people might try combining them with other chess and fairy
chess pieces, which indeed they have (altho i don't know that it's
necessarily because of my pages). also, if mr. abbott was accessible via
the internet at that time, i wasn't aware of it - in other words, i didn't
talk to him at all about the game and so i just assumed he had invented
all the pieces. <P>
i'm not familiar with the games jorg mentioned except tafl, but based on
his description of them, none of these games have any historical
connection with chess. so even if abbott is not the inventor of the
pincer pawn's method of capture or the first to use it in a game context,
it seems he is still the first to use it in a chess variant, for whatever
that's worth. <P>
at any rate, several months ago i typed up a list of piece pages i want to
update / redo, and the PP is already on that list, so i'll make sure i
correct the error when i get to it (could be awhile tho).
Anonymous wrote on Wed, Nov 13, 2002 07:52 AM UTC:Unfortunately the exact rules of Petteia are not known (googling for Petteia will give you interesting information about that game). However, the soldier of Petteia may be the ancestor of the standard chess pawn with its surprising divergent move and capture. You can find an interesting article by Myron Samsin on this theme on http://www.netcologne.de/~nc-jostenge/samsin.htm --Jörg Knappen
Hello, I have a question: does a Pincer Pawn also capture diagonally? I guess not, since that makes the piece way too strong... Greetings joke
In almost all species of Baroque (and Ultima) Chess, the pincher pawn does not capture diagonally. To bring about a 'custodial' capture, the pawn must move like a rook, and the enemy target must be between the pawn and a friendly piece.
I played Petteia (bu did'nt play Ultima), it's pretty interesting! Is there were all pieces moves like in classic chess, but captures by this method? Or something like this? Thank you!
Do pinching Pawns promote? Their greater range would seem to make it unnecessary, but then again promotion is kind-of what makes a pawn a pawn (in FIDE chess and most variants that I have seen that are derived from it at least). I would assume they do but I would like some clarification on the matter.
Checking D. B. Pritchard's description of Ultima in Popular Chess Variants
, he writes, "(5) Pawns do not promote and there is no castling."
, he writes, "(5) Pawns do not promote and there is no castling."Where does the name Pincer Pawn come from? I understand the name is useful for distinguishing it from regular Pawns, but since Abbott does not use the term in his descriptions of Ultima, I followed his lead and called it a Pawn on the Ultima page, and I merely mentioned that it is also called a Pincer Pawn.
I don't know that it's the origin of the term, but the only other place on this site where I can find the Pincer Pawn mentioned is in this variant.
11 comments displayed
Permalink to the exact comments currently displayed.