Enter Your Reply The Comment You're Replying To Joe Joyce wrote on Thu, Nov 20, 2008 03:55 AM UTC:I've read through this thread a few times now, and have some idea of what to say. As always in a large group of people, we have positions that can be seen as polar opposites, and enough people of either persuasion to keep some interesting conversations going. As an aside, is there a third way that can accommodate both of these positions and deal with their issues? Sam, you have expressed the position of one pole better than I could ever hope to. And set out a plan of action that would concentrate the bulk of games played here on 1 single variant at a time. HG's work has given values for the pieces that are workable and consistent, so all you really need for any Capa setup, such as Schoolbook, is some opening studies. Wouldn't these be far more quickly and effectively done if you got some playtesters together and ran several full-kibitz opening-variations playtests of the same game? The object would not be to play games, but to test out possibilities in openings. I do not mean to just push wood, but for each player to look for the best moves and counter-moves in a designated opening, and examine all the interesting possibilities of the first 10 moves, say. Play one version out, then go back and follow up on something you thought of but didn't do. Then do it again. Play a different opening against each other playtester at the same time. You will rapidly gain a vast amount of data for analysis, and it will be gathered from as many different perspectives as possible. I see that as a solid and fruitful project for a few people that can provide some real data for comparisons. If you organize it as a 'Potluck Playtest' session, then each playtester may bring his or her own game, and playtest that game with everybody else, while also playtesting each game everybody else brought. But there is Larry Smith's point of view [the one which goes: 'games are fun - more games, more fun'], which I'd like to expand on. I enjoy more than one game, and more than one form of game. I also really enjoy designing games. [I was an automation expert in the post office, so I did more than my share of endless variations on one theme. ;-) I prefer to expand my horizons.] I like interesting new pieces, if I can understand and use them. I like new board shapes that work. I like good fusion games like Graeme Neatham's Save the Standard, a cross of chess with Tafl. There are a lot of reasonably simple games that fuse 2 genres and so might offer a gateway for many or, more likely, some fun for the handful of players who encounter these games. The best of these are the cutting edge, the source and inspiration for new ideas, innovation in chess. Some like innovation, some don't; it's a question of taste. Edit Form You may not post a new comment, because ItemID Proliferation does not match any item.