Comments/Ratings for a Single Item

~~Earlier~~ ⇧Reverse Order⇩ ~~Later~~

George Duke wrote on Thu, Dec 1, 2011 05:49 PM UTC:

(I) There is no Yiddish, German, or Hebrew word or word combination apparent to suggest 'patzer'. Seriously, where does Patzer come from? Patzer is inferior Chess player by definition. Not Irish, is it, like from Paddy? Pat, or Paddy, gives paddy wagon because of so many Irish policemen about in 1900, but that's different line of derivation. Please explain patzer etymology or slang or plain country of origin for certain. (This ''Nomenclature_Che'' thread, other related issues here for the cv-savvy can be used liberally to prolong discussion. Examples could be trigonal/triagonal, or Vao/Canon/Arrow duplicating names for the same other's recent idea, or any old or new Chess word-topic wanting to be revisited. Suit yourself.) (II.) Once explaining Patzer, someone is invited to coin new word or word combination for ''inferior chess variant designer or design.'' It's only fair. Dis-allowed as too specific-case term to mean ''haphazard/hapless designer,'' are the likes of 'Stanley Randomizer' or 'Gridlocker' or 'HumpMitregier' or 'Nutty Nighters' or XYMYXer. Please do not point to a specific cv like all those terms would. So no more or less direct reference possibly slurring someone's honest try. Rather, what would be good general neologism to describe ''inferior cv design'' -- the needed equivalent to Patzer? Yet too, concise and precise one or two words would indeed seem best fitting this purpose. (III) Two questions really then. Main topic, does anyone know PATZER or not? It is certainly not of Latin Pater either. Then secondly, what is just the right catchy name for 'Patzer Designer'?

Jörg Knappen wrote on Fri, Dec 2, 2011 07:48 AM UTC:

Patzer has definitely german relations, there is the verb 'verpatzen' in
german, meaning to crab, to mull, to fluff, to foozle, to snafu. I don't
know its further etymology, it is quite possible that it is either yiddish
oder rotwelsch.

Jörg Knappen wrote on Sat, Dec 3, 2011 06:28 PM UTC:

Now I found the time to look up patzen/Patzer in an etymological
dictionary. It is a german word;
deriving from the common german wird 'Batzen' (lump, chunk, glob; also a
historic small coin minted in Switzerland) and showing Bavarian or Austrian
spelling (B->P). Batzen is derived from 'Backen' (to bake).

George Duke wrote on Sat, Dec 3, 2011 09:10 PM UTC:

'Patzer' appears in east coast N. American chess circles 100 yrs. ago.
Thanks that certainly knowledge of German originated Patzer.  Then sealing
the meaning is association with English 'patsy' one would think. Albert
Einstein would be one of that generation emigrating from Germany, to
explain such coinage.  Interesting 'snafu', a definition of
'verpatzen', is adopted from initials only c. 1940 Armed Forces use and
caught on immediately. Its taboo origin is totally forgetten, so that
traffic snafu and pipeline snafus make everyday common parlance. Chess
snafu?  --See any overcomplex cv design having too many unknowns. F.i.d.e.
Orthodox Chess and snafu become synonymous, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2A9m-OB_-fE.

Jörg Knappen wrote on Mon, Dec 5, 2011 08:54 AM UTC:

I looked up patsy in the OED, it is attested in 1889, postdating the german
use of Patzer. 

I assosciate the word Patzer to the Viennese coffee house chess culture,
where chess master earned money playing against Patzers. It is the age of
Steinitz (one generation before Einstein and Lasker) or even ealier.

Jörg Knappen wrote on Mon, Dec 5, 2011 03:26 PM UTC:

Ah, and than there is another german word, related but not too close,
'patzig' meaning stroppy, snotty, bolshie. It describes the typical mood
of teenagers very well.

George Duke wrote on Thu, Dec 8, 2011 04:33 PM UTC:

Http://www.chess-poster.com/english/notes_and_facts/chess_quotes.htm --  there's Al Einstein on
Chess (116, 234), thinking of his friend Emanuel Lasker, contemporary gm and
mathematician, Albert consulted on his equations.  Fellow German
mathematician David Hilbert had the relativity equations ahead of Einstein
but shunned the controversy of Newton/Leibniz 225 yrs. earlier.  Actually
not exclusive theoretician, Einstein got practical lab experience as a kid
at his uncle's studio to manufacture electrical equipment in Munich.  As a
result, he could express better than any abstract mathematician real-world
time/force interactions. Physics nomenclature put respectfully into
pre-modern CV art: http://www.chessvariants.org/other.dir/physics.html.

George Duke wrote on Mon, Dec 12, 2011 04:56 PM UTC:

'Patt' or stalemate sounds like german Patzer too. So rule out all of
paddy, pater and patsy and left is 'verpatzen' fitting sound, meaning,
construction and time period. Case closed, and at least one english
etymology book consulted is just plain wrong indicating another language. 
Still up in the air is coinage for the stereotypical 'Patzer-designer'?

8 comments displayed

~~Earlier~~ ⇧Reverse Order⇩ ~~Later~~

Permalink to the exact comments currently displayed.